1. Hey Guest! If you're more than just a WildStar fan and want to keep up on the latest MMO news, reviews and opinion pieces then I'd like to suggest you visit our sister site MMO Central

Are there any concerns regarding wildstar

Discussion in 'WildStar General' started by thrastorm7, Feb 12, 2013.

  1. thrastorm7

    thrastorm7 Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2012
    Likes Received:
    130
    Trophy Points:
    43
    exactly the logic i would like to avoid, so what is stopping us from changing more things? lets add 4 different difficulties so everyone to be able to see and experience the content. or why dont we add 5 men versions, or solo even for those that are rly antisocial... What i am saying here, is that each game should address an audience, if i don't like the game cause will not offer me what i want, i won't play it... thats fair and straight forward...

    Another thing is the difficulty, it is almost impossible to make equal difficulties for different raid sizes, some times the larger will be harder some others the smaller... so the guilds will start picking, ok this week we go 20 men cause this boss we didnt kill the prev week its easier....

    Don't forget that carbine stated that they plan to make a competitive game, and not only that, they also said that elder content will not be for everyone.
    In my opinion that's a choice everyone should make, yes it is part of the game, like it or not... i was playing swtor for example, 16 men was the highest raid, i hated it, but that was it, i made the choice to play it, i didn't qq, i didnt whine, nothing, played it, saw how stupidly easy the content was and i quit..

    You prefer small guilds, you have no idea how i respect that, what the devs want though for their game? that's the question, the world that they will create will it favour big guild or small guilds? well some instances might favour large, someothers small... it's all about the world the devs want to create.
    Draogon likes this.
  2. thrastorm7

    thrastorm7 Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2012
    Likes Received:
    130
    Trophy Points:
    43
    And i replied to you that this is idd a fact, but that's because most of the Guilds are tailored for 25 men content since it's up for many many years, whereas the 10 men (equal to 25 content) just came up... and still you can definitely see the increase on 10 men guilds out there, even paragon world's best guild turned to 10, that must say something
    Draogon likes this.
  3. Kahlan

    Kahlan Guest

    This argument is built on fallacy. I hate to bring controversial topics into any discussion, but this is like saying, "If we allow for homosexuals to be married, then we might as well allow for people to have relations with animals because this is where we're headed." That's just silly. This logic is flawed because it assumes EVERYTHING will change because the game is accommodating smaller groups of people. Having 20 man raids does not = 4 different difficulties. I want challenging content, just like you do. I do NOT want 4 different difficulties and 20 different raid sizes. No one here is asking for that.

    40 mans raids directly impacts the size of guilds, their make up, and structure. IF 40 man raids existed independently from everything else, this wouldn't be an issue. But now, you're impacting community. I thought the goal of Wildstar was to encourage community?

    Moreover, for a game which is all ready having trouble appealing to the masses because marketing has been almost non-existent and the Pixar style is making people believe this is a game for kids - I believe making a decision to ignore players who aren't interested in large raids (which to me, would be the equivalent of being forced to play on a PVP server) is short-sighted. And I will, no matter how much this game appeals to me, not buy it at all if 40 man raids are the only option. I'll simply elect to go PVE end-game somewhere else. And who does that hurt in the end? The profitability and population of Wildstar. Which will ultimately impact you. Because I can promise there are many, many other people that 40 man raids will absolutely not appeal to.
  4. nomotog

    nomotog Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2013
    Likes Received:
    157
    Trophy Points:
    43
    There are no doubt ways to help smaller guilds complete larger raids.
  5. thrastorm7

    thrastorm7 Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2012
    Likes Received:
    130
    Trophy Points:
    43
    You are telling me that has impact on community, you are not interested into large raid content so wildstar will lose you and so on and so forth...

    My question is, is it possible to make everyone happy? some want large, some small, some others want easier, some others harder... what makes you different than the rest? why shouldn't we address the issues that some other guy has and have to do with difficulty, he does not have time to raid 3-4 days per week, and if the content is challenging, there will be no meaning for him to even try, given that he won't be able to progress.... why not to add a raid-finder alike feature for such players? it is not like the example you brought with the homosexuals, what i describe is a reality....
    Draogon likes this.
  6. Kahlan

    Kahlan Guest

    It is possible to compromise. It is possible to acknowledge the majority groups of a community. You can't make a game for everyone, I don't think anyone would disagree with that. But, you can make a game which says, "People who like small guilds make up 40% of our population," and "People who like large guilds make up 40% of our population," and "People who like to solo make up 20% of our population." I'm sure there are statistics out there somewhere that Carbine has access to. So, people who like solo content aren't likely interested in raids, as it is the nature of raids to be social. So, you take the two other groups and you say, "We make PVE raids for these two groups." It's not that difficult. And it has nothing to do with being a hard core game. A game CAN be hard core without catering to a 40 man raid size. You keep bringing up SWTOR. The problem with that game was not the raid size. The problem was that the content wasn't challenging at all. The encounter design was terrible. They could have made raids in SWTOR 40 man and the only thing challenging about it would have been waiting for people to log on.

    You're largely relying on Warcraft and SWTOR for your assumptions. Why does Wildstar have to fit into one of these molds for you? What if Wildstar caters to big and small guilds and the content is so challenging size is mostly irrelevant? Let's break the mold. I agree with you on that. I just disagree that raid size is the only way to achieve that.
  7. nomotog

    nomotog Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2013
    Likes Received:
    157
    Trophy Points:
    43
    60% play solo. (Varied by location) It was talked about in the latest interview.
    Auryn likes this.
  8. Kahlan

    Kahlan Guest

    Thank you. I figured it was higher, but didn't want to come across as only supporting smaller scale game play. I think Wildstar has attempted something really great and unique by trying to make content for solo players too. :)
  9. Ingsoc

    Ingsoc Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2013
    Likes Received:
    171
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    There is a Carbine quote floating around from awhile back, that stated there would be 20- and 40-man raids. No link handy, sorry.

    My concern isn't that there won't be 20-man raiding; I'm sure there will be. My concern is what will the breakdown look like? With the number of ex-Blizzard devs working at Carbine, can we expect something like the Vanilla WoW model where it was mostly 40-mans, with a couple of smaller raids thrown in? What will the loot distribution look like? I really have no problem with bigger raids reaping better rewards, but that can also be achieved with more loot and not necessarily better loot.

    Carbine has really been talking up their 40-man's, and I can understand why. It makes sense from a marketing perspective to try and capture those people who miss the big, epic raids that are largely absent from most modern MMO's. But until we know more, I'm going to remain uneasy.
    Auryn likes this.
  10. Vhiral

    Vhiral Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2013
    Likes Received:
    48
    Trophy Points:
    28
    WS wants to reward all players for their play styles. Is it so difficult to have a unique raids one for a 10 man, one for a 20 and another for a 40? Carbine already said that they want to implement new content every week. So it doesn't seem so difficult for them to implement unique raids for different sizes. I also think that the easiest of the three should be the 10 man. And as the man power needed goes up, so should the difficulty. And the loot for the harder raids should be better. That would force players who would go through the easier one to get worse loot then they would get in the 40 man.

    But raiding isn't even my concern, since this thread is about concerns. I'm more worried about the lack of classes, all I know of are 4 classes. And they are pretty stereotypical classes at that, I like variety but Wildstar really hasn't shown any variety in the classes yet.
    Recruiter and Auryn like this.
  11. Wayoverpowered

    Wayoverpowered Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2013
    Likes Received:
    57
    Trophy Points:
    28
    RIFT basically pulled it off. TSW would have if it had sold well enough (they delivered solid new content for a few patches, but then company mixups due to the financial end of things messed up their pace completely). Newer tech and designs can allow for much more rapid content iteration and production, so if they're committed and "did things right", they could deliver on that promise.
    Patrician likes this.
  12. Wayoverpowered

    Wayoverpowered Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2013
    Likes Received:
    57
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Yep... systems and gameplay oftentimes are VERY different on the larger scale. I'm sort of concerned about there being no non-internal/friends&family beta with what they say is a release for this year, too.
    nomotog likes this.
  13. Patrician

    Patrician "That" Cupcake

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2013
    Likes Received:
    1,013
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Land of the Danes, for now
    Well they wrote a blog post a bit ago all about the Core test, and how to become a Core tester, and what their Core testers do. I think it's safe to say they actually DO have a Core test perhaps running right now behind the scenes, but no one is allowed to talk about it.

    I know in my past history I have been part of a Core test and I am still required by the contract I signed never to say anything about it. I can't even mention what game it was for. ;-D

    So they may be testing right now with a Core group based on survey info or invite or system specs or event attendance and there are people you talk to every day who just aren't allowed to tell you about it. :)
  14. Darkspur

    Darkspur Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2013
    Likes Received:
    122
    Trophy Points:
    43
    To meet that criteria I believe Carbines intent is to create a game which appeals to the widest possible audience, satisfys the greatest number and rekindles the eagerness to join a new MMO that we ALL felt when we were newbies.
    In doing that they will have to appeal to those proportions of the market that generate enough revenue to keep their development program viable; ie: regular updates as already stated.

    Pretty safe to say there will be something for everyone in the game, but if your concept of gaming is a limited fraction of the market and you are very specialist in the way you play then your content will be limited, thats just common sense.

    eg: If I am only interested in crafting at the uber level I shouldnt be surprised to have to chomp through the rest of the content to get there and I shouldnt expect anything more than my market proportionate amount in new content release. (Not a lot)

    For those who arnt aware of the figures;
    65% solo players, 15% grouped with friends (small groups), 15% random groups (small groups) and 5% large groups. Work in the figures for each of those catagories that play exclusively for crafting, roleplay, PVP only and such and you have a tiny large raid proportion left over.

    Carbines team are skilled players too so I expect to see every players needs met in some way but end of the day they are not building games for how they play, they build them for the games to sell, so they can keep getting paid, and they have to sell well.
    Ingsoc likes this.
  15. Wayoverpowered

    Wayoverpowered Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2013
    Likes Received:
    57
    Trophy Points:
    28
    True. I'm just judging off of how most MMO teams have marketed as of late, as far as the concern. I have been in some closed betas myself that were covered by strict NDA's, including post-launch for an MMO a few years ago. I also work for myself as an independent developer (working on my first game now for Android/PC!). So, I know there could be a public beta going on, but chances are it's fairly small currently, hence my concerns. Usually the larger the beta gets, the more leaks you start seeing from people... and I have yet to see any leaks. The merits of this method of judgement as to a beta's size are debatable, of course!
  16. Patrician

    Patrician "That" Cupcake

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2013
    Likes Received:
    1,013
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Land of the Danes, for now
    It all depends on the wording of the contract and how they make you sign it too. Some companies literally take down you name, address, and have you send them a physical signature through snail mail. They take it pretty serious and can even prosecute you if you leak info.

    I agree with you though in that, if there IS no Core Test going on right now, there should be. It's getting a bit late in the planned development cycle not to have a large amount of people testing the game. Their recent questions about how to avoid beta burnout are also telling in that regard, but one does wonder if they were asking to PREPARE for something? Or they were asking to handle something already going on.

    From everything I've seen, I trust 'em I think. It does make a fan wonder and fret though, not knowing for sure if there's a secret beta going on they know nothing about, and desperately wanting in to test and play before anyone else. ^^

    I think what I hope for the most is that even when the beta test gets big the developers take a couple hours now and then just to log in and find people in the world and play with them. That one interview with the Friends and Family tester where he described that happening brought a giant grin to my face, and it really shows their idea of testing is spot on with how I think it should be done.
    Wayoverpowered likes this.
  17. Darkspur

    Darkspur Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2013
    Likes Received:
    122
    Trophy Points:
    43
    To be honest I like the way they do business. Much better that they release information they know is rock solid rather than say 'yeah there will be housing :)' and then say 'oh that will be in a later expansion :(' thats happened just way too many times in the past. When it does, I just lose confidence in anything the company says from that point.
    Cause there are always glitches that can slow development down and delay content release but I get the feeling that the Carbine team know that kinda thing annoys gamers so they only make the promises they can keep.
    That gets some respect in my book. :up:
    Patrician likes this.
  18. Zerdav

    Zerdav Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2012
    Likes Received:
    133
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    Errant Unit
    I disagree entirely that raid size has anything to do with difficulty, and that bigger size should thus be rewarded with better loot.
    It's just a matter of higher chance someone will screw up, but that is not a matter of skill required on your part.
    For that experience of playing with a mass of people you pay with more hassle. Compensation is an epic feeling and a unique experience, and should not be better loot.
  19. qqmoarploxify

    qqmoarploxify Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2013
    Likes Received:
    31
    Trophy Points:
    28
    But you have to consider somthing, is it only 40man raids? Has it been confirmed that there won't be any other size?
  20. Lethality

    Lethality "That" Cupcake

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2012
    Likes Received:
    629
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Orlando, FL
    I agree, and I'd even go one further -- I don't think there should even be multiple sizes of the same raid. Make 40 man and make 20 man but don't make then iterations of the same dungeon.

    The reason is because players will always take the path of least resistance, which in this case would be organizing 20 instead of 40. But then they never get to experience all of the positives that 40 man raiding brings, and it dies on the vine :(
    starspun and Recruiter like this.

Share This Page