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EverQuest Next Reveal Coming Friday

Discussion in 'Gaming Arena' started by Gronky, Jul 30, 2013.

  1. nomotog

    nomotog Cupcake-About-Town

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    Oh your going to be able to be a healer. Healers show up in all kinds of games and you don't need to include the trinity in order to have a dedicated support class. Heck pick any team based combat game and you will find some kind of healer.
  2. Chosenxeno

    Chosenxeno Cupcake-About-Town

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    I agree. I spent 5 years healing in WoW primarily(With a few other games in between) and I've spent the last 8 months healing in Rift. Why do these new games not want my money? Sheesh let's just say 1/3 of the player base plays healers(number based on the average role selection, some include support as a 4th), that's roughly a 3rd of the MMORPG population. I didn't either bother playing GW2 because of this. Also, a few people that enjoy tanking avoided it too. It's a bad idea.
  3. Gronky

    Gronky Cupcake-About-Town

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    Let me point you to below link hopefully showing that good AI may let you play in holy trinity way as well:
    http://www.eqnexus.com/forums/threads/emergent-ai-will-be-challenging.681/page-2#post-8324
    Also EQN is going to use two very cool and new technologies which is just pleasant to read about. Believe me or not, even if does not happen it is a super hardcore mmo like WS, I doubt it will be a failure as most of the other mmo we've recently seen. And in many terms like exploration and liveliness of the world and AI it will most likely be better than any other mmo on the market when it is out.
    http://www.usgamer.net/articles/-in...rybricks-are-helping-to-shape-everquest-next-

    Edit: one snippet from an article which could fit in WS world if they used that technology (I'm not advocating using it for WS):
    "In general, I want it to create things at the level of what you see in Pixar movies, for instance. They have amazing artists and I would like to automate what they do at least for buildings and natural environments"
    Eternalfootman likes this.
  4. Eternalfootman

    Eternalfootman Cupcake-About-Town

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    Note sure if this has been mentioned, but each class will only have a varied amount of either offensive, defensive, and utility abilities. So I can certainly see certain classes having a heavy emphasis on support and healing. They will just also have some offensive abilities as well. Personally, I like to have the ability to defend myself if my group gets into a pinch and is unable to protect me(as a healer). Any other time I'll just stick to support.
  5. jbeezy

    jbeezy New Cupcake

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    I wonder, since in lore most paladins are holy priests trained in the art of war, could you make a priest, then multiclass into warrior to create your own unique paladin build.

    I am VERY interested in trying that out.
  6. Dysp

    Dysp Cupcake-About-Town

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    Probably-ish?

    Just for those who didn't see, as far as I understand, their class system is:
    1. Choose base class, this determines:
      • Weapons - two usable (at least?) which come with 4 abilities each (weapons count as sets, so dual swords would be one set, as would hammer and shield be one set) and have to be swapped
      • Non-weapon Ability Slot types -there are 4 of these ability slots and slot types come in 4 different themes:
        • Movement - ex. teleport, leap, or jump
        • Offensive - ex. Fireball, Magic Missle
        • Defensive - ex. Shieldwall, Spell Reflect
        • Utility - ex. Desummon, Invisibility, Clones
        • ex.1. Blademaster (a balanced class) - has 1 Movement slot, 1 Offensive slot, 1 Defensive slot, and 1 Utility slot
        • ex.2. Wizard - has 2 Movement slots, 1 Offensive slot, and 1 Defensive slot
      • Armor type - one armor type per class
    2. Mix and match Non-weapon Ability Slot skills from any of the unlocked classes
      • ex.1. Choose Wizard, select teleport (let's say a wizard ability) and leap (let's call it a warrior ability) for movement abilities, select fireball (wizard ability) for offensive, and shieldwall (let's call this a guardian ability for the sake of the example) for defensive.
    So... At any one time you can use a total of 8 abilities, 4 from weapons, and 4 from non-weapons. ​

    Class can be changed at any time out of combat.​

    Every class is advanced individually on a tiered system.​

    (assumptions below)
    Judging from EQ2, certain classes will have a polarity requirement, such as good, neutral, or evil​

    Based on the present round-table, races may or may not be restricted from accessing every class. That method is still to be determined (and it's safe to assume that none of the other systems are really set in stone yet)​

    This is the idea I got from the panels. I took notes while listening to the panels, and that's what my notes are. So, hopefully I didn't mess them up while jotting them down.

    ---
    Edit:

    Getting back to the make-your-own-Paladin:
    Starting with a Priest, you'd probably have a cloth armor type, which immediately doesn't sound too paladin-y. I would guess you would want to take a heavy armor class with your desired non-weapon slot type loadout to start with and then add in the corresponding priest or paladin abilities you want later. ...it's really still too early to tell how ex, but it's fun to speculate none-the-less.
  7. AimLock

    AimLock Cupcake

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    No trinity = no buy for me !

    Before that I was look at it enviously from planet Nexus :)
  8. Fishsticks

    Fishsticks Cupcake-About-Town

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    I dont understand everyone who says "no holy-trinity means I wont play!!!!" ... followed by them saying they can't wait to play wildstar.

    As far as I understand it, Wildstar is aiming to allow all characters to shift between multiple classes and is attempting to not have a dedicated healer or tank class.

    Is that not 'doing away with the trinity' ? I'm confused as to how one game is "doing it wrong" and the other isnt
  9. Cael

    Cael New Cupcake

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    Difference being I think, that in Wildstar there will still be dedicated tanks and healers, players just wont be pigeon holed into specific classes since EVERY class will be able to either tank or heal. This isn't removing the trinity, it is just making class choices a bit more varied.
  10. Fishsticks

    Fishsticks Cupcake-About-Town

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    Hmm okay. To me this feels a bit like arguing semantics, but I can also see your point as to where some actual differences in gameplay might occur.

    If I'm understanding the point correctly: Wildstar will have Tanks and Healers, but the character/race/class which plays those roles can rotate. While EQN won't necessarily have Tanks/Healers at all. That about right?
  11. Cael

    Cael New Cupcake

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    Right. In Wildstar, every single class has two roles they can do. Tank & DPS, or Healer & DPS. The game is still centered around the fact that the content needs tanks, dps'ers and healers.

    If I understand correctly, EQN is doing away with Tanks and healers completely. Which is what some people are talking about when they say "No Trinity? I'm not playing!"
  12. Dysp

    Dysp Cupcake-About-Town

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    On WS Trinity

    I believe WS will still have the trinity, it's just that each class has the option to be DPS as well, if they choose to spec that way. Those 40-man raids, with their high difficulty, are going to promote min-maxing and need dedicated healers, I imagine. I think the Limited-Action-Set is bound while in combat, and so you can't just be anything. If you want to be efficient, you're going to need to be focused to a discipline. Pseudo-classes won't cut it when you need to accomplish that specific, dedicated, raid function.

    On EQN
    I'm curious as to how EQN will handle raids, but really, I'm not very interested in that function for their game. We've seen good raid systems already, and it's a field that probably isn't going to see much improvement. Improvements are going to be iterative and probably small, unless some-team completely redefines the mechanics (like Carbine, maybe? :D). EQN's big features really are their proclaimed emergent-AI and their world destruction/construction voxel system.

    Different type of MMOs
    Honestly, I think MMOs are going to need new genre definitions from where I see them going. It's sort of like FPS, with Quake compared to something like Borderlands or even DayZ. They're all FPS games, but they have vastly different fundamental designs. Both Borderlands and DayZ are evolutions of Quake, but definitely they can't trump Quake in its original competitive-shooter field. There already are the two MMO definitions of "sandbox" and "themepark", but I don't feel like those accurately define new and future MMOs. I see WildStar as being a "raider"-MMO or maybe better defined as a "competitive"-MMO, (as it's much like WoW's principle design), EQN Landmark as a "creator"-MMO (because you really only build stuff), and EQN as something else (I don't know what to call it yet, "adventure"-MMO??). In an ideal MMO, it'd have everything (WildStar really seems to be trying to push the envelope here), but with limits such as time, energy, balance, and money, it's very complicated to achieve everything. I think it's smarter to have a primary focus for commercial MMOs, that is, until we have openly designed MMOs. Once that becomes the norm, heck, we'll have everything we ever wanted.. well, because we will be making it. :p

    Back to EQN
    It's quite gutsy of the EQN team to be tackling such a new system, and I applaud them for their innovation and efforts. Even if EQN is a failure or at the very least don't hit their mark, I think just the game's main features'-conception is great for MMOs as a market. That is where I believe MMOs should be heading, not towards bigger and badder raids, loot, pvp-mechanics, spells, etc. I may be reading too much into their design at this point, but I forsee MMOs becoming simply more organic. I suppose if EQN is a failure, one could argue that its failure might sway future capital investments away from their design. We'll have to wait and see how things play out. I'm excited for both WildStar and EQN to launch. It's wonderful to see more great ideas thrown out there and developed.
  13. jbeezy

    jbeezy New Cupcake

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    Except your one-third number is not even remotely close to the mark. All 5-man have 3 DPS for every healer. 10-man ratio is roughly the same. And that doesn't include the tanks.

    A 25-man will typically have 17-19 DPS to 4-6 healers.

    And then there is the gift bag incentive for tanks and heals in WoW. Instant pops for both, and there STILL aren't enough tanks and heals.

    I would venture to say that a typical MMO population has roughly 80% DPS, 10% tanks, and 10% healers.

    Tanking and healing is hard, and people don't like to do it.
  14. Chosenxeno

    Chosenxeno Cupcake-About-Town

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    "Let's just say" = an obvious guesstimate. I'm looking at it from a roles perspective. I never said a 3rd is THE 100% ACCURATE NUMBER number. It's just sample-sizing and guesstimating. Either way it's a poor concept. I'm going to go do something productive now. Bye.
  15. Chosenxeno

    Chosenxeno Cupcake-About-Town

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    I watched the entire reveal. "Allowing" for the Trinity and "Building" the core of your game around the Trinity are 2 different things.
  16. Gronky

    Gronky Cupcake-About-Town

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    Allowing is more restricted. One is a subset of another, and so on. I bet Story Bricks people will do their job well.

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