1. Hey Guest! If you're more than just a WildStar fan and want to keep up on the latest MMO news, reviews and opinion pieces then I'd like to suggest you visit our sister site MMO Central

Healing: Self-sufficient or dedicated class?

Discussion in 'WildStar Classes & Paths' started by nilihanth, Sep 19, 2012.

  1. nilihanth

    nilihanth Cupcake

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2012
    Likes Received:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    8
    So far as I can tell, I'm assuming that healing will be mostly self-sufficient. I imagine it will be somewhat similar to GW2 where each class can sustain themselves but also have abilities to help others.

    I haven't heard of a dedicated healer class or profession. Any confirmation on this?

    UPDATE:
  2. JarNod

    JarNod WildStar Haiku Winner 2012 / Lead Guinea Pig

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2012
    Likes Received:
    815
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Moscow, ID
    When they showed a little bit of the group content in the lowbie zone, one of the Espers was a dedicated healer. Personally, I love having a dedicated healer class just like I love having a dedicated tank class. Mostly because there are different kinds of people that play, some love to heal... some love to tank (like me). Allowing for a dedicated healer lets the players who want to be dedicated healers feel important, and I love helping people feel important.
  3. Maddog Charlie

    Maddog Charlie Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2012
    Likes Received:
    228
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    USA
    Not sure on that, watching the Aurin with the 'flag' ability Im thinking, that could be a heal or buff of some kind ?
  4. Phiqu

    Phiqu Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2011
    Likes Received:
    27
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Germany
    From a big interview.
    nilihanth and Maddog Charlie like this.
  5. Maddog Charlie

    Maddog Charlie Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2012
    Likes Received:
    228
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    USA
    Excellent thanks Phiqu, I watched the gameplay video from the Gamescon 2011 (long) and looks like the Aurin flag and golden armor thing is a level 6+ defensive buff but didnt see anything on healing except the odd potion or stim pack. FYI all this is 2011 so may be outdated in terms of some of the combat, functions etc.
  6. nilihanth

    nilihanth Cupcake

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2012
    Likes Received:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Thanks, Phiqu! Similar to the GW2 mindset, then. Spend less time waiting around for healers or tanks. I'll update the OP with the news.
  7. SiegaPlays

    SiegaPlays "That" Cupcake

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2011
    Likes Received:
    454
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Denmark
  8. nilihanth

    nilihanth Cupcake

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2012
    Likes Received:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Hmm, so it seems like a hybrid then. From what I gather out of that video along with what Phiqu pointed out, it seems that W* classes are going to allow for player-choice in what the class ends up being.

    I'm guessing that I could make my Esper class be a DPS through specializing in my talent tree while another player's Esper could be a dedicated healer through a different specialization.

    While I can appreciate specialization varieties in a single class, it can also become a problem for organizing groups. A merit of the holy trinity style is that everyone knows that the ___ class joining a party is a healer because there's just no other role that class can play. Granted there are exceptions but I'm not speaking to those. If maybe specializations could alter your class title a bit for easy recognition, or maybe a way of displaying your specialization in the chat window, similar to how you could easily announce your skills in Guild Wars for groups to know what you're going to be doing.

    Among friends and guild mates this won't be so much of a problem since they'll know what you've spec'd out for your class. In the event you need to form or join a PUG, though, there needs to be a way for people to know what role you're filling.

    Honestly, I think I lean more towards the Holy Trinity style even though I thoroughly despise fully relying on a healer to accomplish anything. The time I've spent in The Old Republic so far has shown me I don't necessarily need a dedicated healer to help me out, and it's been fun. At the same time, knowing you've got a skilled healer handy lets you focus more on what you want to do. I also play DCUO, which is very very much the holy trinity style and I enjoy my Sorcery Healer very much. I like playing that dedicated role.
  9. Chrilin

    Chrilin Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2012
    Likes Received:
    156
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    Colorado
    ^^ What SiegaPlays said.

    What I gather from this is more like everyone is capable of dealing adequate damage to complete quests or that there will be duel spec. WS has stated that they are going with the holy trinity. I doubt that the system is going to mirror GW2.
  10. starspun

    starspun Well-Known Cupcake

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2011
    Likes Received:
    399
    Trophy Points:
    63
    I think it'll probably be more similar to WoW in that aspect. This has probably changed (again) since I played, but all classes had a damage spec, a couple had additional healing specs (priest, shaman), another couple had tanking specs (warrior, death knight), and yet another couple could choose between all three (druid, paladin - and with MoP, I believe the monk will join them). The remaining classes - warlock, mage, rogue, hunter - were purely for damage. Most of these also had some support capabilities.

    I'm hoping WildStar will step away from pure damage/support classes and give everyone two role options, and some perhaps all three. I can't be the only person who played one of those in WoW and ended up hating having the option to choose between damage with better support, more damage with less support or most damage with no support, but didn't want to start a new character completely from scratch only for the option to play another role on occasion.
  11. Chrilin

    Chrilin Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2012
    Likes Received:
    156
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    Colorado
    I remember when you had to have a particular group makeup to really be efficient with certain encounters. I hated it. When WoW got away from that I was happy. After awhile though they went to far. Now it seems like it doesn't matter what class you are, you bring nothing unique to the fight. Imo this turned from something good to laziness on Blizzards end.

    I would like to see uniqueness return to different classes, but still have them retain relative equality in raid/encounter viability.

    To me it seems like the best way to solve the issue is to make sure there are several specs to choose from. Maybe expand on this further that WoW has by letting a "cloth class" have a spec for tanking or a "dps class" be able to switch to heals and whatnot. This will allow multiple play-styles for all classes without requiring peeps to re-roll to fill in different positions.
  12. Nectavian

    Nectavian New Cupcake

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2012
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Why not marry the tank and healer roles into one? As far as I know, they are only separate because that's the way it's always been...isn't it time for innovation in this genre?

    Exploring the options:
    If you make everyone self-sufficient DPS, you lose the raid system...it becomes a "swarm" system instead -- although this may be cool to some, others really do enjoy being in a non-DPS role. But if you leave a trinity, you perpetuate the difficulty of organizing groups and the hardships of encounter designers to be creative with their mechanics (they are limited to X Tank, Y Heal, Z DPS capable fights).

    If not 1 or 3 roles, why not 2. It's well-known that DPS players far out-weigh Tank and Healers combined. So combine the Tanks and Healers into one role. This would balance the population, simplify the group requirements, and allow for more creative raid encounters.

    It's simple; make healing generate high threat. When the "tanks" heal themselves, they attract the enemies. When they heal the raid, they further attract the enemies. When they heal themselves, they keep themselves alive. You can even get creative with it...for example, a taunt mechanic could heal the target's target.

    I'm just throwing ideas out there. However, I do know that MMORPGs that concentrate on raiding are getting predictable, and some innovation (not setting...I mean mechanics/gameplay) in the basic mechanics (beyond GW2 simply catering to casuals) could make for a breakaway success...which I'd love to see WildStar become. In this genre, it's innovate or die. :/
  13. Black Wolf

    Black Wolf Super Cupcake

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2012
    Likes Received:
    638
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    The Netherlands
    I'm all in for innovation, but also for "If it ain't broke, don't fix it!" The Holy Trinity (HT) works since the age of D&D, so I see no reason to change it or try some strange hybrid version of this.

    I know GW2 got rid of the HT, but that was one of the reasons for me not to play it. I like to heal, tank or do dps in separate roles. I healed for years, tanked for 2 years and some dps in between. Now I'm back to healing and I love it. For some the HT just works.

    I was happy to see W* was maintaining the HT system and if they had adapted GW2's system I would have been a major letdown for me.

    There must be at least one dedicated healing class. And I would love to see that class to be the 'best' healer as well. In WoW all healing classes can heal equally well, and it doesn't make sense to me. Why should a hybrid class like a Druid heal as well as a Priest? Being a hybrid for me it means that you can do more, but less efficient.
  14. Nectavian

    Nectavian New Cupcake

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2012
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    3
    If that's the attitude (more of the same) of the future WildStar players, then this project is already doomed. I'm all for "If it ain't broke"...except it is broke...it has been for 5 years! All MMORPGs with a raid end-game that has gone up against WoW have failed -- this isn't disputable. Why make another failure? I'm not planning to buy and devote real-life time to another character that's just going to grow up in a dying world/server.

    Instead, I'd rather contribute ideas to a franchise that is obviously attempting to innovate **now**, and hope that something sticks and makes this the best it can be. I'm not saying my ideas are automatic wins...but shooting them down with "that's not the way other people who failed did it" isn't getting us anywhere. Why would the proposed changes fail? What are the mechanics behind the failures?

    You say you have healed and tanked. You must have gotten *awesome* queue times, right? Have you asked your DPS friends about their queue times? Let me answer for you...it was <REDACTED>. These are things to consider when looking at overarching design changes...don't be selfish, look for the prosperity of the game and community as a whole in the changes.
  15. JarNod

    JarNod WildStar Haiku Winner 2012 / Lead Guinea Pig

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2012
    Likes Received:
    815
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Moscow, ID
    That's a little harsh isn't it?

    Blackwolf was explaining why he likes the holy trinity in a very sound and logical manner even if it's just his opinion. We can have good discussion without claiming that certain opinions are ruining a game that isn't even out yet, especially since they're just personal opinions.
  16. ObliviousPrime

    ObliviousPrime "That" Cupcake

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2012
    Likes Received:
    490
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Bahrain
    The problem I see with merging the tank and healer together is that with a dedicated healer they are more aware of the health of all the members of the raid while the tank is usually focused on the boss and leading the raid in tactics etc..

    I could see DPS asking for heals while the tank healer guy is busy.

    It might be too much for one person to handle and put people off the role.
  17. Tiktak

    Tiktak Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2012
    Likes Received:
    88
    Trophy Points:
    28
    I agree with oblivious. I don't want to tank. I want to heal or do DPS. I've tried tanking and I have no skill at it at all. It's fun I admit, but even with focused work, and tuition I doubt I'll ever be more than 'okay' at the role! Healing is something I excel at, it's always come naturally easy to me, mixing them both together for me would be a disaster. I'd never get a group again, lol!

    A class with a seperate Heal-tank spec would be cool for those insane enough to try it, but I won't be speccing that way ever.

    Essentially there are 2 choices to how classes work: Holy Trinity or whatever GW2 call their class system.
  18. Chrilin

    Chrilin Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2012
    Likes Received:
    156
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    Colorado
    Agreed..... I was also disappointed with GW2's idea of everything for everyone. To me it seems to make everyone a jack of all trades master of none. This same idea was a letdown in WoW when they started homogenizing all of the dps/tank/healer classes, I said it earlier it just seems to be laziness on Blizzard's part.

    I do not believe the holy trinity to be a death sentence for a game. Like you, I want peeps to be able to enjoy multiple roles for their toons and I do believe the days of confining a toon to only one role should be over. My solution is to give us multiple specs so our toons can enjoy different roles, but do not take those roles away.

    I know I'm paraphrasing you Nectavian, But I promise I read your entire post.

    Converting heals to threat is a cool idea and it might even work. For myself, I'm pretty busy when I tank. I understand that encounter dynamics would have to be drastically changed to make this work, but like ObliviousPrime stated I also worry about being able to concentrate on so many things at once.
  19. pseudo

    pseudo Podcaster

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2012
    Likes Received:
    250
    Trophy Points:
    63
    We're playing a new game here called "attack people for things they like," and you won! Yay, you!
  20. Nectavian

    Nectavian New Cupcake

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2012
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    3
    I'm okay with people having opinions, what I wasn't okay with is shooting down new ideas with the reason being "no, that's different!". If you read the post, you'd see I was asking for a better/clearer criticism.

Share This Page