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Limitations on the Engineer class and an idea for it.

Discussion in 'WildStar Classes & Paths' started by Extatica, Feb 7, 2014.

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How do you want to fill in your Engineer class?

  1. With both pets

    11 vote(s)
    27.5%
  2. With no pets at all

    13 vote(s)
    32.5%
  3. With 1 pet

    4 vote(s)
    10.0%
  4. I'll have to look what the most effective is

    12 vote(s)
    30.0%
  1. Raarsi

    Raarsi Cupcake

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    I'm sorta with the shoulder cannons theme. Maybe have the bots convert or transform into additions to the engineer based on the type of bot being converted or transformed, granting one or two abilities from the converted or transformed bot in addition to some type of visual effect. From this, it could either be applied as a short-term cooldown or a permanent application with some sort of drawbacks like not being allowed any bots out and summoning one would cancel the effect. On the other hand, they have a temporary transformation, so it's not like such a pet-powered concept will come into fruition.

    Ultimately, despite the bot menagerie not necessarily being a mandatory fixture in the engineer's vast arsenal of toys, they are still a convenience. That one distraction from the engineer's attacks, that one source of extra damage available even when the engineer can't get a clear shot, that one snare to let an injure engineer make their escape or hold down the prey for an all-out strike, even that one extra healing source when pots are on cooldown and there's no healer in sight.....it all adds up to a reasonable amount of added efficiency. As annoying as pets and any other character minion systems can be for some (myself included), the sans-robot alternative looks more and more of cutting off your nose to spite your face.
  2. Greatheart

    Greatheart Cupcake

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    I'd love the ability to convert bots into Mech pieces, heck I'd take all four and use them as a passive mech bonus if I'd get a full suit. :D
  3. Micromadsen

    Micromadsen New Cupcake

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    Well I guess if it's still viable (maybe a bit less) to play without pets then there is no problem? I just think it would have fit right in with the Engineer to have something like what OP mentions. Considering that the Engineer is literally supposed to be a walking tank.

    (A bit off topic but a question regarding the bots. Wasn't there something about the bots being customizable to a certain degree?)
  4. Spepijn

    Spepijn New Cupcake

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    Alto I love the idea of a "mec" engineer, I do agree with Benzecry. I don't the bots as pets but as abilities. (Like a super long dot/hot or something) Yes, you do have the "pet bar" but as long as you don't rely on them to do damage (thing wow hunter) I will always look at them as abilities.
    I do think a petless builds could work. I mean, if you look at bots as abilities then you are just swapping one ability (a long dot aka artillery bot) for a diff ability (like mortar strike).
    Will one be better then the other? Maybe. But until the game comes out and we can all start theorycrafting we won't know.
  5. Flinder

    Flinder Cupcake

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    I think you're making a basic category error - "Engineer without pets" is not a thing.

    An LAS without any of the pet abilities is just an LAS that doesn't happen to have those four abilities. Your whole argument is like saying "I want to build a Warrior without any CC abilities so its unfair that I have all these CC abilities in my spellbook." Or "abilities with purple particle effects" or whatever other arbitrary grouping of abilities.

    And you can't wave this away with "Carbine said they want Engineers without pets to be viable".
    Raarsi likes this.
  6. Jicmonster

    Jicmonster Cupcake-About-Town

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    I plan on tanking with my Eng so I really like the looks of that +5% hp and support power u get off the T4 utility bot upgrades. When considering to take bots or not u should also look at their upgrades to see what that could net you.
  7. Micromadsen

    Micromadsen New Cupcake

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    Well I think OP has the same fear as myself. I like the idea of a walking tank (a litteral tank not the mmo kind) but I don't like pet classes in any mmo I've ever played. I like physical range classes but there usually is a pet involved somewhere with those classes. But that's just my opinion of course.

    And as luck would have it I can still play a range class without ever having to use a pet. Which is currently also the class I believe is going to be my first character.

    But that doesn't mean that I dislike the Engineer now does it? I'd love to play as the Engineer infact. Now what is the fear that I then talked about? Well quite simple put: I want to play the Engineer but I do not want to use the pets that are (mostly) a great part about the class.
    But is it viable to play without a pet, or is it going to cripple me beyond belief. Can I still be as viable (maybe a little less of course) as a Petless Engineer as I would if I used the pets.

    I mean there is a certain difference in missing a toe and missing a leg.

    (Again I'd like to stress that I haven't seen any live streams. Nor have I delved into anything regarding the abilities. But from my understanding the Engineer is a petclass.)
  8. Extatica

    Extatica Super Cupcake

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    Carbine already stated that pet-engineers will be able to do their job aswell as non-pet-engineers.

    They CAN be a pet class if chosen, but they don't revolve around pets like some classes in other games. The pets are a bit more like an ability and a bit less of a pet. Yet the pet's still get some form of ''movement control''.

    I personally just hope they'll do more with the ''Mecha'' theme for either both those engineer styles, or the non-pet one.
  9. Micromadsen

    Micromadsen New Cupcake

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    You do realise you aren't making it easier for me to pick a class right? :p
    (Now if only Draken or Aurin could be Engineer then it would be perfect. But oh well. :()
  10. Flinder

    Flinder Cupcake

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    Your concern, as articulated here, is different from the OP's. And I think you have nothing to worry about.

    OP's argument basically posits the no-pets Engineer as almost a separate class - and one that has only 26 rather than 30 abilities. Because if a no-pets Engineer slotted a pet, then they wouldn't be a no-pets Engineer anymore.
  11. Micromadsen

    Micromadsen New Cupcake

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    Yea I guess I got a few things mixed up. I do still like the idea of mech abilities and believe that they would fit nicely with the Engineer though.
  12. Major Eqitus

    Major Eqitus New Cupcake

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    Having the ability to "sacrifice" your bots for a short duration buff would be ideal. Also, having those buffs enhanced by AMPs that enhance your pets would mean those AMPs don't go to waste. I could care less if there was an included graphic of a cannon on my shoulder so long as the buffs were implemented nicely.

    Have some of the buffs be activated abilities and some be passively applied to you as soon as you sacrifice the pet. For instance, sacrificing your tank pet for a 10sec defensive cooldown that replaces your tank pet summon key on your action bar. Ability stays on your bar until you activate it. Artillery bot on sacrifice gives a 15% boost to damage for 10secs.

    These could be used to give the engineer a burst option and more team utility.
    Lanaya likes this.
  13. Extatica

    Extatica Super Cupcake

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    Yup, exactly how I want it to be. Some additional things that focus less on the pet yet still use them.

    But comon.....who doesn't want a FREAKING shoulder cannon!?!?!?!??!?!?! You nuts?!?!?!?!?! :D
  14. Benzecry

    Benzecry Cupcake-About-Town

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    Why yes, I am, thank you for noticing. Still disagree on this entire notion. Can't really say much else since it is just a difference of opinion that won't be shifted in either direction by either party. Though in the end, I don't believe I would care if they did add something like it, again, I just use what works. Still don't think of them as pets though.
  15. Drokk

    Drokk Cupcake-About-Town

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    Having to spend two bar slots on bots is a bit of a turn-off. You'll now have two less abilities to use.
  16. calebrus

    calebrus Cupcake-About-Town

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    Incorrect.
    Bots have active abiilities as well as their passives. These active abilities from the bots are slightly less powerful than a standard ability would be, but in combination with their passives each bot is about as powerful as a standard skill on your bar (according to a quick glance at the maths from character builders).
    There is zero penalty with using bots in skill choices as the OP would suggest. The only "penalty" would be if you consider controlling and directing the bots to be such, in which case you can simply ignore them as we have stated multiple times.
  17. PrimeMover

    PrimeMover New Cupcake

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    I feel like all the classes I'm looking at have the problem of losing choices based on gameplay type so it isn't a problem.

    For the Engineer, as you said, it is the pets. I don't want to use pets so I wont slot those 4 abilities.
    For the Medic it is the fields for me, I don't like placing fields so I wont slot those abilities.
    For the Spellslinger it is the stationary abilities so I "lose" those.

    I haven't really looked into the other three classes enough to speak to them.
  18. Drokk

    Drokk Cupcake-About-Town

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    You sure about that? I've been watching engineer streams and I don't see any 'active abilities' you can use with your bots. Other than like...assist, attack, move. Which I doubt you mean.
  19. Extatica

    Extatica Super Cupcake

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    Click the ''summon bot'' ability again and it's an active ability

    Bruiser bot: AoE taunt (jumps towards them)
    Artillery bot: AoE dmg nuke for a few seconds.
    etc.
    etc.
  20. calebrus

    calebrus Cupcake-About-Town

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    Yes I'm sure.
    Look at the bots here: http://ws-base.com/builds/generator/engineer
    Each one has a Bot Ability listed. Those are active.

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