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Paywalls and you (ESO related but not exclusive)

Discussion in 'Gaming Arena' started by Dirty Outlaw, Jan 30, 2014.

  1. Dirty Outlaw

    Dirty Outlaw Cupcake-About-Town

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    After finding out about imperials being a playable race only thru paying (by this forum in Everybody to the flop thread no less).

    I also happen to watch this vid today as well



    now are paywalls something to be expected and is it ok, is it wrong, is it a good idea?

    We are all used to things like expansions and DLC which is a paywall essentially.

    Do we draw the line in races, classes, the fact the game is sub based or not.
    Are people being overreacted or is this the sign of the times and how companies do business as far as gaming concerned?

    Since I started this thread its only fair I put my opinions out there as well. I don't think paywalls are bad and extra content is extra, as long as its not p2w or something that breaks the game I don't think exclusivity is a bad thing. If I heard good things about ESO that made me want to get it I would consider shelling out extra to it. But at the same time I wouldn't want companies to simply do this as a cash grab, an attempt to squeeze extra before the ship sinks so to speak as well which is something I agree with completely with the video I posted on this thread.

    Any thoughts?
  2. Benzecry

    Benzecry Cupcake-About-Town

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    To me it just depends if the game itself for all it has is enough to justify its price. If I was paying the full price for one race and you could pay extra for six more races, I'd be a bit pissed for an elder scrolls game. For what is essentially the other human race, as long as they aren't superior somehow in stats then I don't really see the problem. Aside from if you are a massively loyal to that one race, maybe I could understand getting a little mad..but like I said before in another thread, at that point you probably love the series enough to pay anything for it to begin with.

    I think the title of the video speaks for the entire argument, "TESO locking an ENTIRE Race behind a Paywall." Taking the liberty to caps what I mean, it is so melodramatic. Oh my, the slightly different race is on a premium, what ever will become of the game. If the game is bad, then the race being locked isn't the worst problem. If the game is good, then no one will care because they just want to play. If the game is mediocre then they will likely hand it out for free to keep the servers open. Talking about how this sort of thing affects all games is a bit more valid, but this is neither the first, nor the most egregious use of paywalls. It just seems like a lot of fuss for what will in a year from now not even be a conscious thought in anyone's mind.

    If anything I want game companies to learn and the paywalls for the future, it is the same thing for xbox one, learn how to talk to the costumers. They could have spun this to be less of a deal to people. I believe in different context, the exact same action by a company could either be a great feature or absolutely hated by the community.
  3. Dirty Outlaw

    Dirty Outlaw Cupcake-About-Town

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    Yeah I agree on most parts personally this whole debacle is a flash in the pan but I figured something to talk about while the iron is hot. Something to think about on paywalls and how far is too far though.
  4. Extatica

    Extatica Super Cupcake

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    TESO had a nice playerbase from the other games.....with this action they affect that group! The group that would most likely play the game anyway!

    And a lot of MMO'ers find it a F* action and therefore won't even begin, youtubers are mad.

    All in all.....this news just dowgrade the entire game on another level.
    I think this ''paywall race'' done more damage to the game then good, and in the end I think it has cost them money.
    Yes they'll make it free eventually (the race first) but I personally think it wasn't a wise decision.

    And I personally think that you should never put an entire race behind a paywall!
  5. Roadblock

    Roadblock Cupcake-About-Town

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    It is a bad precedent.

    There is this recent trend that P2P / B2P / F2P business models keep getting intermingled by companies in the quest for a better return of investment.
    That's all fine and dandy for them but consumers are entitled to have a different perspective.

    The dichotomy between base and premium features is in a way a given for F2P.
    There needs to be some incentive for players to spend some money on the game since access is free.
    Still even in that model there's variants and "good" and "bad" F2P implementation mostly revolving around the concept of core and peripheral systems.
    This is different to base / premium because that only relates to price while core / peripheral is a gameplay distinction (at the risk of oversimplification, social dynamics, player power etc could be considered core, cosmetics peripheral)

    On the other hand sub traditionally meant an "all inclusive" experience in principle.
    The major selling point was you pay a recurring fee so you don't have to worry for extras, they come in the package.
    Your initial purchase to recoup part of the development costs and the recurring access fee to fund the maintenance costs, bugfixing and feature additions.
    New content depending on the company comes at an extra 1 time purchase to unlock or sometimes included in the sub fee.
    This is a tradeoff since for a sub game paying is mandatory, you give up the freedom to pay when you want for what you want for the promise of steady / increasing quality, maintenance and content updates.

    This new model where the lines blur and you have base and premium content in a sub game I consider very customer (and gamer) unfriendly.

    In the end I think it would be in our best interest if this practice was identified as the crux of financial failure for games that try to take it too far, as it would discourage other companies from attempting the same.
  6. Extatica

    Extatica Super Cupcake

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    And that is exactly the reason why I love the fact that those youtubers ask the same of the gamers! Just to give off a signal that this, indeed, is a step too far.
    (As to weither that is succesfull.....that's another question)
  7. Benzecry

    Benzecry Cupcake-About-Town

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    Imagine the reaction if Chuas went behind a paywall. The horror..
  8. Convicted

    Convicted Super Cupcake

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    To me I view it as cosmetic, its just a "skin" the same way that the mini pets and mounts are just re-skins. Neverwinter showcased this in every update, a reskinned mount/pet that had the exact same animation and behavior as the other ones, they even had the Drow race exclusive for the first 3 months, it never made a difference in-game except to people who wanted everything "right now".
    Unless the Imperial gives a distinct player advantage and allows them to progress more or do content others cant do, then I wouldn't care about it.
  9. Extatica

    Extatica Super Cupcake

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    I know where the Carbine employee's live :sneaky:........:devilish:
  10. Extatica

    Extatica Super Cupcake

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    A cosmetic does NOT come with it's own unique racials!!!! (Passive and/or active racials)

    And in some games those racials can be quite effective. Can you imagine if WoW had their humans/undeads behind a paywall? All good PvP'ers went for those racials!

    See the problem there?
  11. Benzecry

    Benzecry Cupcake-About-Town

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    Yeah, but then they would be pissed in general, like everyone in WoW who didn't want to play human for PvP. .. So many humans.. the horror..

    Oh and I don't believe they could actually keep the Chuas contained, xP
  12. Convicted

    Convicted Super Cupcake

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    yes but the game in question is ESO, so does the Imperial class come with racials, and if so, are they "quite effective"?
  13. Dirty Outlaw

    Dirty Outlaw Cupcake-About-Town

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    This just goes with my belief that racials shouldn't exist or at least not effect pvp/pve combat.
  14. Extatica

    Extatica Super Cupcake

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    Well duuhh....that's why I said it ;) (thought you'd get it) The Imperials come with racials (atleast from what i've read/heard).
    How effective they are?....I don't know.
    But still it's a bad thing! Even if they aren't that effective.
    Welcome to WS then :up:
  15. Convicted

    Convicted Super Cupcake

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    I loved the racials in classic Wow and loved the way they were used in pvp and pve. I think more devs should take the stance they did then, and just ignore the crying.
  16. Dirty Outlaw

    Dirty Outlaw Cupcake-About-Town

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    It enforces minmaxing and playing races for racials rather than personal choice also in vanila a lot of races got the short end of the stick on racials
  17. Sfr528

    Sfr528 New Cupcake

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    My major problem with this is that the game already costs $59.99. They are essentially asking their customers to pay for content that they already have developed for no other reason than to line their pockets with more of our cash.

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