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Problem with Faction Presentation

Discussion in 'WildStar Races' started by Quantum Wizard, Jul 25, 2013.

  1. Quantum Wizard

    Quantum Wizard Cupcake

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    I know that Carbine has stated that neither side is good or evil in Wildstar, And I think thats a great Idea! However this is coming from a guy who normally plays chaotic good. I played an orc on WoW because they felt wild and untamed. So as you can guess I'll probably play Exile or if I play dominion Ill likely go Draken. However this is only half the issue. It seems clear that the Dominion are the Lawfully aligned faction and the Exiles are the Chaotically aligned faction. Which I think is what carbine was going for, But...

    Maybe its just the rebel cowboy in me but the Dominion definitely comes off as the bad guys. Not as much Evil more like misguided and fanatical. They go around forcing people to conform. Or at least thats how they come off anyways. I'm sure in the actually game their are plenty of things that will make the exiles look bad or the dominion look good, But their needs to be a little more out of game stuff to paint a more clearly grey picture. Like maybe doing a World War 2 esq. propaganda film portraying Exile terrorist attacks and or the Emperor taking part in some humanitarian effort.

    Of course thats not my only worry. I like to play good guys and hate having an immoral action forced on me by a game. I don't even play classes i feel are evil Like Warlock or Necromancer, Why do I want to do an evil mission? I don't like it when I get a evil mission thrown in my lap and cant proceed without completing it. Ill grind if I have to but I shouldn't have to do a mission like that just to skip out on grinding, And I mean that for both sides! I will most likely end up having to play dominion because my older brother is easily sold on stuff like the Chua. So I dont want to have to commit war-crimes to advance. Its fine to have missions like that just dont force people to play them is all. Sorry rant.
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  2. Outburstz

    Outburstz Cupcake-About-Town

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    Both sides are good in a certain sense as well as evil its all up to personal opinion . The Exiles fit you more because you want freedom which is what the Exiles want. Now they may not use "good" means in order to gain that freedom but if you look at it from their point of view they feel it is justifiable to do that because of how the Dominion has acted vs certain races. As a wise man once said you don't win a war by being the nicer side you win by beating the other side and this is indeed a war.
  3. Extatica

    Extatica Super Cupcake

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    The only wild and untamed race are: Draken and Chua.....

    And YAY, another lawfull/evil/good etc. thread :D
    No offence, but there is plenty that show the Exiles are the bad guys.....have you read all the lore? (I have before you ask....they always ask...why do they always ask it back?...)

    But it's also about YOUR perception of the lore!

    Things can be seen as evil by the Dominion while others may say it was ''normal'' etc.

    So you may percieve it as ''not gray enough'' while I say, it's pretty gray! (Although I do get the feeling the Exiles are more evil then the Dominion after all the lore).
  4. Quantum Wizard

    Quantum Wizard Cupcake

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    Realy ive read everybit of lore i can get my hands on and it seemes pritty clear cut Exile Good Dominion Bad. Can you link me some stuff you felt said otherwise?
  5. Extatica

    Extatica Super Cupcake

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    Well it does depends how you look at it:
    Even if it was a threat, it this the right solution? the right answer?
    Punishable by death, nothing but correct, what's wrong with that? Then don't help them....they knew the consequenses...why count it on the Dominion for following the rules they made? Harboring criminals, murderers, rebels.....yes that's good.....You don't believe that yourself, now do you?
    Really, do you go send zombies something to eat if something like that would happen IRL?
    Go watch zombie movies, the Dominion reacted for the greater good for most of their citizens...why condemn such noble and protective decission? Don't forget the desease can still spread, and the Mordesh can still turn into ravanous killers....what's ''good'' in that? You tell me....

    The planet Nexus.....well the ones who would have a legitimate claim on the planet would be: The Luminai = The Dominion.

    See, since our perception of the lore is different we see the ''good'' and ''bad'' differently aswell :D And these were just a couple of things.

    So were's the ''clear cut good'' in those Exiles actions you speak of?
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  6. Evgen88

    Evgen88 Cupcake-About-Town

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    That was a really lame attempt to try and make it look like there isn't a good and bad side in the game.
    The Dominion looks like bad guys and they are. They act like villains you see in every Black/White story. The Exiles are just as obviously the good guys. Very Empire and Rebels. You could also argue any oppressive dictatorship was just, but no one is buying it bucko.
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  7. Rafe

    Rafe Cupcake

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    I do believe it's a perception issue, Extatica. Cause I'm with him on the Exiles being the good guys. Dominion forces others to see their way and think any law they have is for the "greater good" and that ends justify means, and that is pretty evil to me in itself.
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  8. cBselfmonkey

    cBselfmonkey New Cupcake

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    http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/02/21/massively-exclusive-a-closer-look-at-wildstars-cassians/
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  9. Lucker McNoob

    Lucker McNoob Cupcake

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    Unlesss Carbine start to put out videos of all the good stuff the Dominion has accomplished, as well as the bad things The Exiles are doing, we will have good vs bad when the game launches.

    It doesn't matter if there are shades of grey in the lore:

    "Hey guys read these heavy articles, the Dominion are really nice guys sometimes. And when you're done, watch this video of e mechari shooting a random dude in the face for no reason!"

    Have fun explaining "it's a matter of perspective" to the vast majority of players that never bother with the lore.
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  10. Kasern

    Kasern Cupcake

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    I've read as much as the lore as I could find, and it really does seem like the Dominion are the bad guys. Cartoon bad guys, but still bad guys.

    They "claim" they were placed in charge by a race that disappeared and use that as an excuse to force their own ways onto others or crush those that refuse. They actively seek to recruit dangerous or otherwise useful races to the empire, rather than welcoming all.

    When they sent an ambassador to the Granok it was because they wanted the big <REDACTED>s on their side, and any diplomat will tell you that sometimes you take missions that risk your life. The Granok were a pre-tech barbarian race that reacted to a creature that goes against their beliefs the way you would expect a primitive amazonian tribe to react to a ringing cellphone.

    The Dominion then going to war over the death of a single diplomat? No. If they weren't spitefull, ruthless <REDACTED>s they'd have simply moved on, declaring the Granok unfit to join the empire until they evolved a bit.

    Then there is the Aurin. Okay, punish them, I guess. But they weren't members of the of the empire habouring the rebels. They were an independant planet that had never encountered either faction previously. The Dominion simply used it as an excuse to exploit a resource-rich world.

    It even states in the Chua lore that they joined the Dominion so that they could exploit the resources of other worlds after they ruined theirs.

    With the Mordesh, instead of quarinting the planet and helping the survivors find a cure, they quarintined them and left them to die. Yes, I get it, zombies. But plenty were crying out for help - hence the Exiles coming to their aid.

    And the Exiles themselves. The lore states they are the descendants of those that rebelled against a tyranical empire, that the Dominion were putting down riots on the homeworld with lethal force and that caused an Admiral to turn against his masters.

    No. The Lore, and the Meet the X videos are all skewed towards the Dominion being the bad guys. Again, cartoon bad guys, but bad guys nonetheless. Obviously there are good people living within the Dominion empire. Perhaps even entire planets. The Mordesh sound like a pretty utopian civilisation pre-contagion and I doubt they are alone in the galaxy. And there are probably soldiers being sent to Nexus that are just following orders or who were raised on anti-exile propaganda - just as the Exiles no doubt were raised on anti-dominion propaganda.

    But we don't see that. What we see is an emperor who loses his tempter and crushes a glass after being all bond villian, with his army of robots and storm troopers vs a spunky redhead and her band of ragtag rebels.
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  11. Pmizzrym

    Pmizzrym Cupcake-About-Town

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    This is about Nexus

    Exiles need a home

    Dominion consider it their birth right

    I hate archaic rpg alignments, why is my character here? Because it's a new freaking planet.

    What do they want? Treasure and adventure.

    This isn't D&D I just cannot fathom how you can just say Chua is chaotic/lawful evil, every race is w/e the player makes it. And with that in mind every player is basically true neutral.
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  12. Steampunkette

    Steampunkette Cupcake-About-Town

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    So the Granok murdering diplomats is cool... But the ensuing war it caused is the Dominion's fault.

    Sounds about right. :p

    -Rachel-
  13. Extatica

    Extatica Super Cupcake

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    Yet they will see a Granok standing on a small hill shooting around him with 5 dead bodies around him as beeing a good guy???
    Also reason is not given in the video + he laughs after shooting 5 people dead, so it must mean he's a good guy.....
    No offence (so it is), how can we take you serious if you think Malvolio is the Emperor????
    First line you say you've read up on the lore......yeh right :p
    Please reread everything again then.....
    Also they don't just ''claim'', they ''were'' chosen by the Eldan.....don't go suddenly make it into ''speculation'' if it's true.

    So because the Granok were ''Barbarian'' it was oke to kill someone? Well I see the Empire more as the Roman Empire here....so they had killing rights aswell then....(sounds stupid? Yup that's right so is the part of Granok killing oke because they are primitive.....).
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  14. Steampunkette

    Steampunkette Cupcake-About-Town

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    The murder of a political figure in the commission of his duties is an act of war.

    -Rachel-
  15. Skippy

    Skippy Well-Known Cupcake

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    This "political figure" was a mechari right?
    How does one murder a toaster?
  16. Steampunkette

    Steampunkette Cupcake-About-Town

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    They're autonomous, sapient beings. That makes them people in every way that matters.

    -Rachel-
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  17. Skippy

    Skippy Well-Known Cupcake

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    And the granok knew this how? How exactly did the granok know that this "machine" that came to them, is not just that? A piece of machinery (with granok being rather primative) that may have appeared as a threat.
  18. Extatica

    Extatica Super Cupcake

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    And for The Dominion the Granok were nothing more then ''potential helpfull rocks'', why is it evil to wage war on rocks?

    See these kind of ''arguments'' are just....not really good (to put it friendly).

    The Mechari spoke, the Granok listened. So they had all the time to see it's somewhat of a living thing. Don't forget they are rocks themselves, why wouldn't they see Mechari as alive then?
  19. Steampunkette

    Steampunkette Cupcake-About-Town

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    Basically this. If they're such a primitive race how do they know the difference between a Machine and a "Person"? Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic, after all. A walking talking metal man would probably be -less- alien to a group of stone-people than a pink and fleshy "Person" who is half their size.

    -Rachel-
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  20. Kasern

    Kasern Cupcake

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    I completely disagree. If the Dominion is an enlightened space age Roman Empire, who have dealt with countless worlds before encountering the Granok, then they should have been the bigger of the two and realised they were dealing with dumb barbarians.

    As to it being an act of war, sure if you're talking about two nations who understand that. The Granok were a collection of tribes led by tribal chieftians with a strong cultural religion that forbid them from using technology. How do you think they felt about a walking, talking machine?

    And imo it's not fair to compare a space faring empire to the Romans. The Romans were little more than barbarians and thugs themselves.

    And yes, I do say they claim it. It was a thousand years ago. I say the Dominion are lying.

    (With regards to whomever was in the video, I don't know nor care. What I am saying is that who "we", the people who are supposed to only watch the videos and get excited for the game, see. This thread was about presentation of the factions, not what people with too much time on their hands can dig up from dev posts that could be retconned before launch. Presentation of the factions to the average person is in the videos and the site race/class etc sections.)

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